tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post114383058172866995..comments2024-03-23T19:16:01.555-07:00Comments on Can it happen here?: Immigration in California politicsjaninsanfranhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07548452260456734928noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post-1144239073827271322006-04-05T05:11:00.000-07:002006-04-05T05:11:00.000-07:00Well, if we can win at all that means my worst fea...Well, if we can win at all that means my worst fears are not justified. If they are--it won't matter what margins we actually secure among people going in and pushing buttons, we'll still be told we didn't.<BR/><BR/>Since 1998, the only manner in which Californians have fallen for the Right's ploys has been the recall election. Otherwise this state is solid. At least in terms of Democrat vs Republican. <BR/><BR/>We know that isn't enough. But some of the best progressive leadership this country has in office is from here. I live in Sonoma County, in Lynn Woolsey's congressional district and Wes Chesbro's state senate district and Patty Berg's assembly district, so when I feel a need to make a special effort, I have to go out of town.Mark H. Foxwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09742816212489965058noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post-1144209555101771112006-04-04T20:59:00.000-07:002006-04-04T20:59:00.000-07:00Mark -- interesting. I completely agree with you t...Mark -- interesting. I completely agree with you that many immigrants bring with them some quite leftist traditions. In my neighborhood, many of the newcomers are from Central America and are very sophisticated critics of unbridled capitalism, much more critical than most North Americans.<BR/><BR/>As for McPherson and the Diebold machines -- could be. We have to win by a lot -- work to do.janinsanfranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07548452260456734928noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post-1144206320625361562006-04-04T20:05:00.000-07:002006-04-04T20:05:00.000-07:00I commented on a similar comment on a Pandagon thr...I commented on a similar comment on a Pandagon thread and the answers I got were kind of non-sequiturs, but that thread is dead so...<BR/><BR/>I am not so sure Latinos are such reactionaries. In fact, I've seen a fair amount of evidence that Marxist leftist ideas have way more currency in Mexico than here. Makes sense; until the Bolshevik revolution in Russia, the Mexican Revolution was the hot item for world leftists, especially American ones, and Woodrow Wilson responded with "appropriate" panic.<BR/><BR/>Mind, I suppose there need not be a conflict between patriarchy and Marxism. It may be that many of these Mexican Marxists fail to reflect that leftist revolution might revolutionize the relations between men and women, and homophobia may also prevail among some leftist movements too. Then when these people come to El Norte and realize that on what we have of a left, we perceive progress as a package, they just might retreat into reactionary patriarchy.<BR/><BR/>Nevertheless, I think a major reason US culture has promoted bigotry against Latino immigrants in general has been a real fear that their culture contains revolutionary thought that might cross-fertilize with our own slumbering revolutionary tradition to bring the poor working people right back into the political arena. <BR/><BR/>And I believe that insofar as this happens in California, the outcome is to fully radicalize all parties, and feminism and acceptance of gayness becomes normal even among people with a different tradition.<BR/><BR/>I for one see the rising Latino tide as a bastion against reaction, and insofar as I trust the democratic process at all I feel confident California is that much safer. And by and large, our legislative process has borne that out. I am frustrated to contemplate the wonky impotence of Sacramento, but it is not nearly as scary as it was a decade ago, and for this I thank Latino voters. The iconic moment for me was when Loretta Sanchez defeated "B-1 Bob" Dornan for Congress in Orange County, not once but twice--because the Republican Congress listened to his absurd racist charges of illegal Latino voting and refused to seat her. It used to be that I regarded Orange County as a lost cause, and it is only Latinos who changed that.<BR/><BR/>Of course we are in some danger, but it is mainly from a fascist takeover from above in the form of manipulating election results. I am very worried about Schwarzenegger's appointee Secretary of State ramming Diebold machines down on California counties that have hitherto been sensible enough to avoid them, and fear a "surprise upset" in the fall elections that will blatently contradict both sentiment on the street and every objective poll predicting the otherwise obvious Democratic victories. <BR/><BR/>No doubt if this happens, the press will be full of nonsense about California's "sensibly conservative" Latinos having "gotten over" their "tantrums" against Wilson. We've seen it happen on a national scale, with fairy tales about the fundamentalist vote securing a "mandate" for Bush in 2004.Mark H. Foxwellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09742816212489965058noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post-1143844143488056892006-03-31T14:29:00.000-08:002006-03-31T14:29:00.000-08:00Thank you for your time and insights. They are he...Thank you for your time and insights. They are helpful.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post-1143837582633550212006-03-31T12:39:00.000-08:002006-03-31T12:39:00.000-08:00Anonymous above: thanks for asking. I'll try to an...Anonymous above: thanks for asking. I'll try to answer a little.<BR/><BR/>I do believe that the growth of the Latino population will change our society and that some of the values that some Latinos hold are in conflict with mine. I am after all a lesbian, so I worry about Catholic bigotry. But mostly I see that from the existing white hierarchy, so I blame those old guys, not my low wage worker neighbors. <BR/><BR/>Remember, becoming Californians changes people too, just as new Californians change the state. My partner teaches ethics to college freshmen. Most of her students are immigrants of one sort or another. Most are far more liberal than the average white California voter, combining a live and let live attitude toward "lifestyle choices" with strong impulse toward justice for low wage workers and families. She has a lot of hope for them.<BR/><BR/>And, when it comes down to it, it is not for us to approve of our immigrant neighbors. People are here--we need to get used to it and work together to make the state work. "Aqui estamos; no los vamos" is simply true.janinsanfranhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07548452260456734928noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11093162.post-1143836078367290212006-03-31T12:14:00.000-08:002006-03-31T12:14:00.000-08:00I'm an older liberal woman, a native Californian, ...I'm an older liberal woman, a native Californian, and I have some questions I'm not getting any answers to. (Truth in advertising: over at dKos, on a related subject, I was told to "shut the fuck up" and accused of channelling Michelle Malkin. Not helpful, and not true.) Perhaps you can help me, if you will. You certainly seem to be qualified to do so. <BR/><BR/>When I look at hispanic immigrants, I see a possible flood of social conservatives. I'm inclined to fear that their current alliance with social progressives is a "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" kind of thing, from their point of view. Not cynical, simply expedient. To look at the worst possible outcome, I'm concerned that we'll end up with a Catholic/fundamentalist/anti-feminist dominated California. And as a not-Catholic, not-fundamentalist feminist, I can't help worrying, especially for my aggressively feminist daughter.<BR/><BR/>I genuinely want to know: why aren't you worried?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com